Minutes of the 9/20/2002 Little River Airport Advisory Comittee 1. Open meeting: 9:00am 2. Attendance: A. Present Tim Scully, Trey Loy, Willow Trent, Tom Goncharoff, Susan Winding B. Visitors: Kathie Sarin, Ed Powers, Stephen Ford (DOT) Robin Bell and Naomi Jarvie C. Excused - Steve Schoolman D. Absent - Dennis Vest 3. Minutes of previous meeting - approved 4. Correspondence: A. email from Tim Scully to Tom Peters and Stephen Ford of DOT B. email trail between Janelle Rau (assistant Clerk of the Board) and Tim Scully C. email exchange with Pamela Townsend of Planning D. email exhchange with Tom Peters of DOT re draft ALP E. email from Cheryl Quist expressing interest in becoming an alternate member F. report on telephone conversations with Ed Powers G. report on telephone conversation with Tom Peters 5. Kathie Sarin reported that she had not received an Oath of Office. Tim Scully said he would follow up again with the Clerk of the Board immediately after the meeting. 6. Kathie Sarin noted (with respect to the email exchange with Pam Townsend regarding airport transportation) that Enterprise also rents cars at Little River. And some of the B&Bs will pick people up. 7. Stephen Ford of DOT said that Erica, the right of way agent is still waiting for the appraisal to be completed before an offer can be made on the parcel at the end of runway 29. He said that as he researched, looking for the original plans of the airport, he ran into some interesting history. The reason the airport includes land past the wye is because there was originally a plan (later dropped) for a cross-wind runway. 8. When asked about a land swap to obtain the parcel if Mr. Powers' escrow closes, he said that land swaps are hard - you must have matching land values and both parcels have to be appraised. It is usually better to buy one and sell the other. Tim Scully expressed concern of the statement of "matching values" and Mr. Powers' statement that a trade has to "make economic sense". Stephen Ford replied that value to DOT and to Mr. Peters might be different and that we shouldn't write of the possibility of a trade yet. If escrow closes, the right of way agent will contact Mr. Powers. 9. Tim Scully suggested that if negotiations for a land swap break down, perhaps the County could consider buying an avigation easement which would protect the GPS approach and get the trees cut. 10. Stephen Ford reported on the status of the hangar project. He had a fat printout of data from the Erectatube web site. The draft ALP shows two 50x50 box hangars and a row of 40x40 box hangars. But Stephen Ford said that Erectatube has a 33 x 42 box hangar that might make more sense for the row of hangars. Ten of these would cost $107,000 FOB the factory, plus about $12,000 for freight, not including site preparation or assembly. These are 26 gauge metal. He talked with the Coast Guard, which has experience with metal buildings along the coast and they recommended heavier 24 gauge metal. There was a brief discussion of possible hangar rents. Stephen Ford said that Uhiah is changring 22 cents per square foot. For a 33 x 42 hangar that would imply $305 per month while for a 50x50 it would come to $550 per month. It is too soon to know what the rent will be for our hangars. 11. There was a discussion of hangar roof styles. Trey Loy spoke strongly in favor of gabled roof - the steeper roof improves roof lifetime. Doors were also discussed. The Erectatube hangars have sliding doors which move on nylon rollers. There was general agreement that good ventilation is important. Stephen Ford said he had been told that insulation could help even more than ventialtion in controlling condensation. 12. There was a discussion of the revised ALP. 13. There was a discussion of the public meeting to be held to discuss the ALP revision. We should have copies of the noise abatement policy, information oh hangars, FAA funding, and the GPS approach 14. Susan Winding expressed concern over environmental issues not addressed by Shutt Moen's work. 15. Robin Bell is interested in the nonpilot alternate position. Cheryl Quist also expressed interest in this position. We agreed to agendinze this for the next meeting 16. next meeting will be Friday October 18 at 9am at the Clubhouse at the Woods 43300 Little River Airport Road 17. Agreed on agenda for the next meeting. Adjourned at 11:00am The agenda for this meeting is: Approve the minutes of the last meeting Communications (letters, FAXes, etc, sent/received since last meeting) status reports and discussion on: * The GPS approach, vegetation management plan * additional hangars at the airport * clear zone acquisition * Airport consultant status * LRAPA application for a pilot/tourist supply shop * possible selection of a nonpilot alternate AAC member * meet with Shutt Moen, airport consultants and plan for a public meeting on the Airport Layout Plan update Reports from subcommittees Public comment Agree on a date, time and place for the next meeting Agree on agenda for next meeting Members of the Little River Airport Advisory Committee ------------------------------------------------------ Tom Goncharoff Trey Loy non-pilot, lives near airport Steve Schoolman pilot, flight instructor & woodworker Tim Scully inactive pilot (lost medical), computer programmer, lives near airport Willow Trent airport neighbor, non-pilot Susan Winding airport neighbor, non-pilot, business owner Dennis Vest airline pilot Alternate Members of the Little River Airport Advisory Committee ---------------------------------------------------------------- Kathie Sarin pilot (there is an open nonpilot alternate position) ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tim Scully Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2002 7:52 PM To: 'Tom Peters'; 'Stephen Ford' Cc: Tim Scully Subject: LRAAC items of note from the 8/16/2002 meeting The Airport Advisory Committee asked me to send you a few questions. These arose after the committee members read the airport consultant and subconsultant's scope of work. If one of you are able to come to the next meeting, an informal verbal response would be fine. If not, a brief note would be helpful. One committee member interpresed your status report and the agreements to mean that Shutt Moen is not involved in the hangar project. The rest of us have the impression that they are providing advice about hangar siting and funding (loan application). Can this difference in interpretation be resolved? We are also concerned about the FAA grant application for the AIR-21 funds. Do you see any progress on this on the horizon? Is Shutt Moen able to provide any advice to aid in completing this process? Am I correct in assuming that the ALP update is a necessary precursor to an application? We see that one public meeting will be held on the ALP update. The committee suggests that October or November (preferably November) would probably be a good time for this, if the draft ALP is available before then. We have agendized planning for a public meeting for the next LRAAC meeting (9/20/02) in the hope that we could meet with you then to plan the event. If a draft ALP is available, I can distribute copies to the committee before our next meeting. Ideally, I'd like to get it as an AutoCAD DWG file or as a large raster file (at least 200 dpi, full size). I can make copies to distribute to the committee. Thank you again for all of the effort DOT has been putting into airport issues. Respectfully Yours, Tim Scully, Ph.D. Chair, LRAAC ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Janelle Sent: August 23, 2002 9:41 AM To: Tim Scully Subject: RE: Little River Airport Advisory Committee I can send you a version of an oath, but it will have to modified greatly, as the Board is not the appointing authority in this case. Not sure who will notarize, etc. I spoke with Frank briefly, as this is a bit 'different' then our standard process related to the appointment of alternates. I'll see if I can find an example, I'll forward it... Janelle -----Original Message----- From: tim.scully Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 9:30 AM To: rauj Cc: tim.scully Subject: RE: Little River Airport Advisory Committee Ok, I called County Counsel's office and spoke to Frank. He said that we were on track and that alternates do need to execute the oath of office, just as regular members do. He said that alternates have the same voting authority as a regular member, when substituting for one. The Board delegated the authority to appoint them to the LRAAC. Could you send an Oath to Kathie? Thank you again. Tim > -----Original Message----- > From: Janelle > Sent: August 23, 2002 9:10 AM > To: Tim Scully > Subject: RE: Little River Airport Advisory Committee > > > Hi Tim ~ Yes, I am aware of the ability to 'appoint' > alternates, however, I > am uncertain as to the Board's role in approving or > acknowledging those > alternates. I am also uncertain of the voting authority of those > alternates, given that they have not been appointed by the > Board. This is > why I would urge you to seek Counsel opinion. I do not have > an e-mail for > them, but you may reach them at xxx > > I am sorry if this sounds a bit formal, but I do believe this > would be the > best way to address your questions... > > Thanks! > > -----Original Message----- > From: tim.scully > Sent: Friday, August 23, 2002 9:05 AM > To: rauj > Cc: tim.scully > Subject: RE: Little River Airport Advisory Committee > > > I was told that it is expensive to ask County Counsel > opinion, so I've been > reluctant to do it. Given your urging, I'll go ahead and make > the leap. > > The Board Resolution forming the LRAAC gave the Committee the power to > appoint alternates. So we think we have the authority to do > this. But I'll > check with County Counsel. Do you have an email address for > County Counsel? > > Thank you for your advice, I appreciate it. > > Tim > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Janelle > > Sent: August 23, 2002 9:00 AM > > To: Tim Scully > > Subject: RE: Little River Airport Advisory Committee > > > > > > Hi Tim ~ I am curious if you've talked with County Counsel > > regarding the > > selection of alternates. As this is a Committee that is > > governed by the > > Board of Superivsors, the Board is the body who has the authority to > > appoint/direct that alternates even be considered. Some time ago I > > suggested that you talk with County Counsel regarding this. > As to the > > alternates that you say were appointed, they cannot be > > considered actual > > members until the Board considers the addition of alternates to the > > Committee. If they do, we'll have to notice those > vacancies, to which > > anyone may apply. The Board would then make appointments > > based upon the > > recommendations. > > > > I highly encourage you to seek County Counsels opinion ... > > > > Janelle > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: tim.scully > > Sent: Thursday, August 22, 2002 8:05 PM > > To: rauj > > Subject: RE: Little River Airport Advisory Committee > > > > > > The Little River Airport Advisory Committee met on 8/16/2002 > > and agreed on a mechanism for appointing two alternate committee members > > to serve when regular committee members are unable to attend a meeting. > > The committee appointed Kathie Sarin as an alternate pilot member. > > > > We'd like to know if she needs to execute the oath of office which the > > regular committee members were required to sign, or if there is any other > > required formality for the appointment of an alternate member. > > > > Here is the resolution we passed regarding alternate members, > > in case it is > > of any interest: > > > > > > Alternate members will be classified as either pilot or nonpilot members. > > They will meet the same membership requirements as regular members of the > > same category. In other words, pilot alternates must be registered voters > > in Mendocino County. Non-pilot members must either reside within a > > 10 mile radius of the airport or must be a business person from a > > neighboring town in the County and in any case must be > > registered to vote in Mendocino County. > > > > Alternate members may be appointed at any time. Their term of office will > > not exceed 24 months and will expire on January 31 two years from the > > January preceding their appointment. > > > > Alternate members will be elected by a majority of a quorum of regular > > committee members after the election has been appropriately agendized. > > > > We will appoint one pilot alternate and one nonpilot alternate. > > > > Thank you for your help. > > > > Respectfully Yours, > > > > > > Tim Scully, Ph.D. > > Chair, LRAAC > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tim Scully Sent: Monday, August 26, 2002 8:53 AM To: 'Pamela Townsend'; Tom Peters Cc: Tim Scully Subject: RE: Little River Airport- FYI Thank you for sharing that! I'll pass this on to the LRAAC. For what it is worth, there are the following available now: The Mendocino Stage Coast Flyer's car rentals One of the limiting factors probably is the weather. There are sometimes long periods when the airport is fogged in and there is not air traffic. Tim > -----Original Message----- > From: Pamela Townsend > Sent: Monday, August 26, 2002 8:40 AM > To: Tom Peters; Tim Scully > Subject: Fw: Little River Airport- FYI > > > Here is an email we received, for your information. > Pam Townsend > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Frank Lynch" > > > > > Either ignore, or include as thought for GP/LCP updates. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Debra White" > > > > > Forwarded mail. > > > > > > Debra White, Office Manager > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Justin Rowe" > > > > > > > Hello, > > > > > > > > I was wondering if there were bus or vehicle arrangements > > > > from the Little River Airport to local destinations such as > > > > the Little River Inn, the ocean, or Mendocino. This would > > > > enhance Mendocino as a fly-in destination. If you look at > > > > a sectional chart of the north coast, there are hardly any > > > > public airports and fewer airports with fuel. State > > > > Cal-Trans funds sometimes cover improvements like these. > > > > After developing the Monterey, California Airport, it has > > > > created quite a hub of activity for that area. Thank you > > > > for your thoughts and consideration. > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > Justin Rowe > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Tom Peters Sent: Monday, September 09, 2002 5:52 PM To: Tim Scully Subject: RE: Little River Airport ALP Good. Let me know if you have any problems using them. tom -----Original Message----- From: tim.scully Sent: Monday, September 09, 2002 5:41 PM To: peterst Subject: RE: Little River Airport ALP I received both files safely, thank you. > -----Original Message----- > From: Tom Peters > Sent: Monday, September 09, 2002 5:17 PM > To: Tim Scully > Subject: Little River Airport ALP > > > Tim, > Attached is the file for sheet 1of 3. I will send you sheet > 2 by separate > email. Sheet 3 is still a work in progress. We do not have > a copy yet. > Send me an email after you receive it. > > Tom > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Cheryl Quist Sent: September 18, 2002 12:32 PM To: Tim Scully Subject: Little River Airport Advisory Committee Hi Tim, I'm interested in joining the LRAAC committee as a non-pilot member. I got your name & contact information from the airport manager the other day. I've owned a home in Albion for 12 years (on Navarro Ridge Road), am a US citizen, and am very interested in seeing the airport maintained and developed in a reasonable manner. It's such a great asset to the community and key to accessibility for the Mendocino area--whether for tourism, business development or medical assistance. How can I get involved? I understand there's a meeting on Friday, but unfortunately I will be out of town. Best regards, Cheryl Quist ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- I received two phone calls this month from Mr. Ed Powers, the most recent on September 19. Mr. Powers is in escrow to buy the parcel which the County is trying to buy at the end of Runway 29. He says that he would like to trade this to the County for another parcel, but that if a trade is not negotiated quickly, he will proceed to build a 25 foot tall equipment storage building on the property. He said that he has talked to Planning and Building and has been told that a permit would be issued. He has contacted the Department of Transportation to try to negotiate a land trade, but DOT does not feel it is appropriate to negotiate with him when he does not own the property (because escrow has not closed). Mr. Powers said that he believes the escrow will close on September 20th. I asked Mr. Powers what he wants. He said that he wants a trade that "makes economic sense", i.e., one that is profitable. He suggsted trading for a parcel zoned to allow him to build self-storage units, or for 3[!] residential parcels. He said he is open to other offers if they "make economic sense". He is not interested in the land to the south of the airport because of its lack of access. His first choice would be land near Fireman's park [which is not available for trading]. His second choice is land near the wye, which marked on the ALP as "to be traded". ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- I received a phone call from Tom Peters of the Department of Transportation. We discussed the issues raised in the email I'd sent on August 22 and Mr. Powers first telephone call in September, regarding a possible land swap. Tom Peters explained that Shutt Moen had been helping with the hangar project, providing advice on siting and funding. The draft ALP shows the result of their work on hangar siting. Tom Peters said that he has been talking with Shutt Moen about the AIR 21 grant process. He will be attending an FAA workshop on funding on September 20. The ALP update is an important step in the process. There is also going to be a chance to update the Capital Improvement Plan in December. DOT wants to be sure that we don't miss the chance of getting this funding for our airport. We discussed when it would be best for Shutt Moen to meet with the LRAAC and when the ALP public meeting should be held. We tentatively agreed on inviting Shutt Moen to attend the October LRAAC meeting and on November for the public meeting. Tom Peters asked if we could have an extra LRAAC meeting if necessary and I said that we had done this in the past when working on the GPS approach issue and I expected the committee to be willing to do it again if need be. I told Mr. Peters about one obvious error in the draft ALP - it shows Fireman's Park as "future" rathar than "existing". The future dog park is also not indicated. We discussed Mr. Powers in-progress purchase of the land at the end of runway 29. I expressed concern over his intention of building a 25 foot tall equipment storage building, Because the County height zoning ordinance is based on FAR 77 and FAR 77 has lesser standards than the FAA now sets for GPS approaches, it would be possible to build a building that complies with the height zoning ordinance but still interferes with a nonprecision GPS approach. And if we want to keep open to possibility of a precision approach at some time in the future, a larger trapazoid would be needed. Tom Peters explained that DOT has been following the Federally mandated process for trying to buy that parcel from Mrs. Senna. This is admittedly a slow process, but if we don't follow it carefully, then we would not be eligible for reimbursement by the FAA. He said that the appraisal should be completed by the end of October. I asked about land swaps. Tom Peters explained that DOT feels it would be improper to negotiate with Mr. Powers about a possible land swap while he doesn't legally own the land. The Board of Supervisors and the FAA would both have to approve any trade of airport land. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------